Monday, November 15, 2004
Shooting
Technically speaking, I'd have to say that this Marine is probably guilty of murder.
I might article 15 him and fine him a couple hundred bucks.
To tell you the truth, I'm torn.
Clearly, the murder of prisoners cannot be tolerated.
But I can't bring myself to care much about this victim. I care more about the due process of law and the discipline and order of the force.
Personally, I don't think anyone who gets caught fighting from a mosque needs to have any expectation of quarter. Especially nonuniformed scumbags like these guys. Maybe that's a healthy message to send to would-be guerrillas elsewhere.
I'd just as soon put all these fuckers down like so many sick animals. And I'm a world-reknowned softy compared to a lot of guys.
It's not personal; it's just business.
I have a lot of respect for the honest guerrilla warrior.
But the Fallujah insurgents are just dogs.
Now, another question for you legal eagles out there:
From very early in my military career, I was taught that standard operating procedure, when in the offense overrunning an objective or an enemy position, was for every soldier to pump two rounds, center of mass, into every enemy body in his lane on the way through the objective, out to the limit of advance. That is, unless the enemy in question was actively trying to surrender to you, or otherwise clearly incapacitated. Once you pass him, though, you cannot go back and shoot similarly arbitarily, Once you secure the objective, you can't just shoot all the bodies again; you have to pop them on the first pass.
This seems to me to be reasonable enough. It's simple, it's easy to explain, it lets soldiers and marines protect themselves from getting hit in the back as the pass through the objective.
But assuming that the presence of civilians on the objective can be ruled out, is an SOP to do so technically a legal order?
Splash, out
Jason
I might article 15 him and fine him a couple hundred bucks.
To tell you the truth, I'm torn.
Clearly, the murder of prisoners cannot be tolerated.
But I can't bring myself to care much about this victim. I care more about the due process of law and the discipline and order of the force.
Personally, I don't think anyone who gets caught fighting from a mosque needs to have any expectation of quarter. Especially nonuniformed scumbags like these guys. Maybe that's a healthy message to send to would-be guerrillas elsewhere.
I'd just as soon put all these fuckers down like so many sick animals. And I'm a world-reknowned softy compared to a lot of guys.
It's not personal; it's just business.
I have a lot of respect for the honest guerrilla warrior.
But the Fallujah insurgents are just dogs.
Now, another question for you legal eagles out there:
From very early in my military career, I was taught that standard operating procedure, when in the offense overrunning an objective or an enemy position, was for every soldier to pump two rounds, center of mass, into every enemy body in his lane on the way through the objective, out to the limit of advance. That is, unless the enemy in question was actively trying to surrender to you, or otherwise clearly incapacitated. Once you pass him, though, you cannot go back and shoot similarly arbitarily, Once you secure the objective, you can't just shoot all the bodies again; you have to pop them on the first pass.
This seems to me to be reasonable enough. It's simple, it's easy to explain, it lets soldiers and marines protect themselves from getting hit in the back as the pass through the objective.
But assuming that the presence of civilians on the objective can be ruled out, is an SOP to do so technically a legal order?
Splash, out
Jason
Comments:
We'll what do you think the Marine grunts did to the Japs on those Pacific Islands during WWII. Expecially when they got wind of what the Japs were doing to our POWs.
Art 15, fine, no don't think so. Perhaps a out of country 8 day R&R, Thailand, Hong Kong, etc. The kid is young probably and seen to much S*it. Do we want hard chargers or "looking over their shoulders" grunts. I'll take the former, with a tight leash.
The mistake I see is with this embeded BS. Some Liberal Photo boy with a camera\video. Going to rat off something he sees. Those grunts should have told the puss with the camera to hand over the tape, or else.
Art 15, fine, no don't think so. Perhaps a out of country 8 day R&R, Thailand, Hong Kong, etc. The kid is young probably and seen to much S*it. Do we want hard chargers or "looking over their shoulders" grunts. I'll take the former, with a tight leash.
The mistake I see is with this embeded BS. Some Liberal Photo boy with a camera\video. Going to rat off something he sees. Those grunts should have told the puss with the camera to hand over the tape, or else.
# posted by 
: 8:39 AM
: 8:39 AM
1) I'm more torn than you. I'm horrified, of course, that this would happen, but I'm a civilian and a lot of people spend their lives making sure that the only horrible things I see are on DVD, and I'm thankful for that. I hope that the media attention doesn't make things worse for him then would happen otherwise.
2) I'm guessing the embeds will become unpopular among units. I'd guess they weren't particularly loved before, because nobody likes it when they have to work with a camera over their shoulder, but when that camera could cause a world of shit to fall on you, that makes it worse.
2) I'm guessing the embeds will become unpopular among units. I'd guess they weren't particularly loved before, because nobody likes it when they have to work with a camera over their shoulder, but when that camera could cause a world of shit to fall on you, that makes it worse.
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